Honest Christian Conversations
A weekly podcast dealing with cultural and spiritual issues within the Christian faith.
Want to be a guest on Honest Christian Conversations? Send Ana Murby a message on PodMatch, here: https://podmatch.com/hostdetailpreview/honestchristianconversations
Honest Christian Conversations
The Power of a Personal Relationship with God
What if your understanding of faith could shift from ritualistic to deeply personal? Join us as we chat with Amelia Walden, an inspiring author who has navigated the complexities of a mixed Jewish and Catholic upbringing to find a profound faith in Jesus. Through our conversation, Amelia shares her heartfelt journey and the transformative moment when she fully grasped the meaning of Jesus' sacrifice. We discuss her metaphorically titled book "From Jew to Gentile" and the liberating discovery of a genuine relationship with God, free from the bonds of legalism.
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Amelia Walden is bubbly and a sweet woman. I enjoyed interviewing her. She has such a love for the Word of God and it's probably because for many years she struggled to let go of her overly religious background and find her own way to God. Through cuts, bruises and scars of life, she found a relationship with Jesus and today she is here to share her findings with you. Be sure to share this episode with family and friends so they too can be blessed by the contents of this episode. Thank you, amelia, for coming on today and discussing your book with us. I am very excited to talk to you. I've been reading through your book. I love it. Just, you can hear your personality in the way that you did it. I find that fascinating. There's not many people can do that, and you said from the get go, in the beginning of it, that that's what you were going to do, and you can clearly tell you did that and I find that very fascinating.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you, thank you so much All right, so go ahead and tell us a little bit about your book.
Speaker 2:Right. So my book is really about my testimony. I grew up in a Jewish and Catholic home, a little bit watered down from both of the religions, but the foundation was really set the cultural aspect of Judaism and then going to mass with my father for Catholicism so it really set the tone for what I believed God to be. And then I discovered later in life what faith actually was and I found my own faith and my life completely transformed from that moment on. So that's what the book is about about all of the mistakes and everything that I did in my past really leading up to finding a faith of my own, finding a relationship with Jesus, and how everything in my life transformed after I found that relationship.
Speaker 1:Nice and, like I said, it's a beautiful book. I love it so far. I'm almost done with it. So it's called From Jew to Gentile and in your book you mentioned that you are a quarter Ashkenazi Jew and we all know even you wrote it in the book that you can't actually change from being a Jew to a Gentile. So how do you mean that?
Speaker 2:Yes, so that was one of the first things that I wanted to clarify in writing the book, because I think a lot of people look at the title and they're like that can't be.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm merely using Jew and Gentile as metaphors. So Jew is meant to symbolize religion, traditional religious rituals, whereas Gentile is meant to really symbolize transformed by faith.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, that definitely clears it up for a lot of people. I'm sure a kisser they're probably looking at the title and intrigued by it but at the same time going that doesn't make any sense. You can't actually do that. So it's good that you took the time to explain so that people aren't off put by it. They get it and it makes sense it does. So you mentioned that your mom was Jewish and that your father is Catholic. How did those two religions kind of being taught in the home? How did they shape your view of God?
Speaker 2:So, like I said, they were both watered down. I think the Jewish side was much more cultural. I got that mostly from my grandparents. My mother never went to temple with us. She didn't, you know, have, she didn't have us read the Torah or anything like that. It wasn't something that she continued from her parents. I would get the cultural side of it when my and I say this in the book, but when my Jewish grandparents would come to celebrate Christmas with us.
Speaker 2:I thought that was funny, Sort of a weird little thing there, but definitely got more of the culture from them. As far as the Catholic side going to mass and going to a Catholic high school I was taught the religion. I was taught the prayers. I was taught what I was supposed to do when I was supposed to kneel, when I was supposed to stand up.
Speaker 2:I was taught all of those things but wasn't ever taught about God's character. I wasn't taught that he loves us and I knew that Jesus had died for our sins, but didn't really take that in or take that to heart as to what that actually meant and that actually didn't hit me until I was writing the book, when I was writing it down on the pages, and it really hit me my gosh. Yes, you know, Jesus died for our sins. That is for us, that is a loving thing that he did for us. I didn't understand God's character. I thought he was all rules and no fun and thought that people that believed in God were judgmental and mean and just. I didn't have an accurate picture of what God's character was.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that feels like my childhood. I grew up in a Christian home. It was more of the legalistic, which is something you kind of touch on too, and I've actually had a guest on several podcasts ago. They also have the same story of legalism and the trap of it, so it is an easy trap to fall into, I think, regardless of what religion you're actually in.
Speaker 1:I think it's possible to follow legalism in general, for whatever religion you're in, and I kind of grew up in a Christian home where it felt more rules, this is what you do, this is what you don't do. And it was really hard for me as I got older and was trying to live my life, to live my life, to figure out why am I doing this? Why do I believe these things? And once I started taking a step back and realize it's my life, I don't feel like I'm actually a follower of Jesus. What do I do about that? That's when I started having the same epiphany that you did, that I didn't really know Jesus, that I didn't know him the way that I should, and it's such an eye-opening moment and it's sobering and it's exciting, but it's also scary at the same time because if you had died before that moment, you know where you would be.
Speaker 1:And that's crazy to think I just got chills yeah, I know To think that. I mean I always had that nagging feeling in the back of my head Am I saved? Am I going to go to heaven? If Jesus comes back now and the rapture happens, am I going to be left behind? I always worried about those things. I don't worry about them now because I've got that assurity, but to die not knowing that, I think, is really scary, and I'm glad that you were able to escape out of that, that you found the freedom that comes with knowing Jesus in an actual relationship, and I wish more people would have that.
Speaker 2:Well, and I think that there's so many people in the Christian church today that fall into legalism. I've had interactions since I came back to faith where I've had to put up boundaries with individuals that told me legalistic things and tried to impress them on my life and I had to say wait, hang on a second. That's not what the gospels teach us, that's not what the Bible says, and I think as a culture, sometimes Christians take that legalism just too far, unfortunately, and it turns a lot of people off to Jesus, and that was a lot of the heart behind the book was people stuck in legalism, people that have only seen the church as legalism. To pull them out of that, to show them that it's not that you were shown an improper image of Jesus.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's great. It's good that more people are coming out and they're sharing their stories and helping people get out of that, because nowadays it's very important that the church stands firm on the actual, true gospel, because there's a lot of lies being thrown around all over the place. So I appreciate your book very much and it's so easy to read. It's personable, like I said, it just feels like you're sitting there talking to the person. That's so amazing that you were able to do that.
Speaker 2:I love that so much so funny, because I don't think I could write another way. I really think that's good. I think that's the only way I could write. I just I don't know how to write.
Speaker 1:You know, formally yeah, I think that's what makes it easy to read, is that it just feels like you're having a conversation with somebody and that's that's really good Kudos to you. I don't know to separate those two, but to also, because I guess.
Speaker 2:I should back up. So religion and relationship, they are always going to be intertwined. Doctrine and faith are always going to be intertwined. You can't have one without the other, or I should say you shouldn't have one without the other. So today I think that I really try to well, I try to remember the sermon. If a student going to school to become a doctor says that they don't want to learn basic biology, then how are they ever going to become a doctor? I think that's true for faith as well, that if you don't ever want to learn the doctrine and the foundation behind the faith, then that relationship can't be fruitful and it can't come to fruition because you have to know God's word in order to further that relationship, to have your personal walk with Jesus. Think, studying the word of God and studying scripture is so vitally important to people that love him and want to follow him and have that relationship with him. Because how can you have a relationship with somebody that you don't know? You have to have that, yeah.
Speaker 1:I agree. And scripture reading is something that I'm trying to be more intentional on, especially with my kids. They're always complaining I don't know how to do the right things. I tell them read the Bible. God knows, he's telling you. That's him speaking to you, so listen. And there's something that I also need to listen to have been more intentional on making sure I read the Bible once, maybe twice a day.
Speaker 1:But coming out of a legalistic style, it's really hard to where if I don't feel like doing it, and then I decide, well, maybe I won't do it. Right now, that legalistic nagging in the back of my head goes oh, but you're not doing it. You said you would do it every single day. It's not that much. You can just read a chapter, you can just read a verse, it's not a big deal. And then the other part just comes out and starts saying oh well, god might be upset. You know what if something bad happens today and I hate that so much because it's not a spirit of God at all that's me and my own worries wondering what will he do to me if I choose not to. And that's wrong thinking, because that's not how he works and I have to remind myself. That's not how he works. He understands that I'm tired that I'm not here, and sometimes your spouse is the same way. Sometimes they just don't feel like talking at the moment. Maybe they're sad and they aren't ready to discuss it yet. You can't make them discuss it. It's not going to be a healthy conversation. It's the same thing.
Speaker 1:One of my other guests, on a different episode, said God is Jesus, is a gentleman. He's not going to just barge in. He's not going to come up to you and say why aren't you reading my word? Hello, I want to talk to you. If you're not reading his word for the day and he has something to tell you, he'll find a way to tell you. He has something to tell you. He'll find a way to tell you he spoke through a donkey at one point in the Bible. So I mean he will find a way to talk to you if he has something that important that if you chose not to meet with him at that moment, he'll make it happen somehow. He'll get his point across. He's not going to just leave you hanging and you have to worry. Did I miss it? You have to go into it with a loving heart, a heart that wants to have that relationship. You can't make a relationship that would be a one-sided and that's not really a relationship.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:That's my soapbox, but I think so many people fall into I know myself I fall into that too, when, when I choose to sleep in, or you know I'm tired, or whatever happens, whatever comes up I mean wife, mom, kids, work, I mean it all gets a lot sometimes and when I don't read the Bible, that legalistic part comes back. Oh, amelia, you're not doing what God wants you to do and have to really think about. No, god loves me, he gives grace, he knows where I'm at and he knows my heart. That is such a big thing that I think I always repeat to myself God knows my heart. And I also do love that phrase that you said God is a gentleman. It's been one of my favorite things.
Speaker 2:We have to open the door. He's not going to come barging in a door that we are not inviting him into. If your heart is inviting him into a relationship with you, he is going to find a way to get his message across to you, like you said. But he's not going to push you past your limits. He's not going to push past you. You know, like you said, when your spouse is tired and they just don't want to talk, you can't force them to. That's yeah.
Speaker 1:You're not going to get anything out of it If you just read, just to read. You're not there to listen to God anyways.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is definitely a struggle I have that I'm trying to work through. I think that's going to be a lifelong struggle for me too. Yeah, I know I'm pretty sure it's going to be for me as well. I'm 40 right now. So, yeah, it's been a lifelong struggle.
Speaker 2:You have 36, so I'm right there with you sister, you're not that far behind.
Speaker 1:I found a part of your book that I really liked and I wanted to read it. And you know, talk about it. Oh, thank you. It was on page 85. Let's see, we're going to read. Despite my learning and growing, it was never toward him and he still showed up for me, even when I wouldn't acknowledge that these things that were happening were him. I was legalistic and stubborn and couldn't see what was right in front of my eyes. I found that very profound and I could totally relate to that, because that was my story of after I came back to Christ. I could see where he was doing things, although I could kind of see in certain areas where he was working while I was in the midst of my backslide, but that just resonated with me so much. It's absolutely true, when we're being stubborn and not thinking about anyone else or God, we can't see what he's doing, but he's always there. He loves us and we're His children and he's there to be with us, to protect us, to lead us ultimately into His will, because there's no escaping it.
Speaker 2:Right. Well, and it's so true because I look back on my life and there's a couple stories that I tell about my I mean one stubbornness, but two, just the mistakes that I made and the situations that I got myself into. And when I look back at those situations, I can see so much where His hand was there protecting me and guiding my path, and I was blaming so much on God. That wasn't God. It was flawed people modeling the church for me and I was turning them into gods, which is obviously completely wrong. But it's what I was taking away from. The message that was being given to me was that, you know, these people are showing me a God that just doesn't care about what I'm going through right now and just wants to, you know, tell me how much of a sinner I am and how bad I am, and you know, and all of that, which it's just that's not the right way to think about it and that's not him or his character at all.
Speaker 1:I agree. Amen to that. Where did you get the inspiration for your beautiful cover? I like it mostly because of the color patterns. The teal is one of my favorite colors. It's one of my favorite colors too, is one of my favorite colors.
Speaker 2:It's one of my favorite colors too, that's awesome.
Speaker 1:I always do the teal heart emoji. Yeah, I use a lime green one. There's a teal. I have to find it now. Lime green and teal are my favorites, so now I got to look for the teal.
Speaker 2:Nice. So that is actually one of my favorite stories to tell. There was one morning where I was writing the book I wasn't physically writing at this time, but it was during the process of writing and my daughter woke up in the morning and she came to me and she said Mom, god gave me the cover of your book. Jaw hit the floor. I was. I was shocked. But she has come to me with things like this before, with baptism and faith, and she's taught me things that she's learned at school and she has furthered my faith. I said you know we're on our way out the door, but you know it, will you draw it for me when you get home tonight? And she was like, yeah, sure, it was. Just it was nothing to her. God, god gave me the cover of your book in my dream. When we got home from school that night she sat down and she drew it and I took that image and I sent it to the publisher and they sent me some artwork back. They sent me probably five or six proof copies.
Speaker 2:As soon as I got those images back, I took them to her and I said hey, which one of these did you see? You know which? Which one of these is it. And she flipped through them and she instantly landed on the waves and stopped and she said it's this one, but the waves need to be turned this way. And she turned my phone from being a portrait to landscape and she said you know, it needs to be this way. Was I mean shocked that she was able to articulate that to me and just say she immediately stopped it's this one and the waves need to be turned? That was so profound to me and I wrote to the publisher and I said, hey, let's turn the waves. And then I showed it to her again when they sent the copy back and she was like, yeah, that's it. I was like, okay, girlfriend, this is the cover If God gave you the cover of it, then I am all in.
Speaker 2:I love that he used her in this process.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's beautiful. That's a great story that you two will be able to tell for the rest of your lives. That's amazing.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. She's very proud of it too. She tells everyone. She says my mom's an author and I did the cover. That's cute.
Speaker 1:That's her claim to fame. That's great. Oh yeah, Well, in your book, I noticed that you had some footnotes every once in a while and it says it's a gig break. Share with us what a gig break is, because I thought those were cool.
Speaker 2:Awesome. I'm glad you liked them. So while I was writing and I really do feel like this entire experience of writing was a completely Holy Spirit-led moment in time for me and things would happen, experiences would happen. As I was writing, Dots would be connected randomly. My husband would watch an interview on TV that he'd never watched before, but then I had, you know, the link that they had sent as one of my research tabs, or the link that they talked about on the interview.
Speaker 2:It's just, things would come together and I would go to tell my friends about these experiences and every conversation would end with God is so good.
Speaker 2:And so when I was having one of those conversations with my friend Lisa, she had texted back God is so good. And I was like, oh my gosh, God is good. God is good. Break the moments in time that you stop and you can see God's hand at work in your life, right in front of you, not looking back, but directly in your present. You can see God's hand and you stop and you have to say God is so good. And so I wrote those into the footnotes. Originally I had them as a break in the narrative and the publisher thought that they would be better as the footnote. So we put them in the footnotes and you can either read those right where the number is and see how I wrote it real time, or you can read it at the end of the page, end of the chapter, wherever it makes sense to break from the narrative and to see what was happening in my life present day as I was writing the book.
Speaker 1:That's a really cool idea and I think that's going to start a trend, a give-break, because it's important for us to remember the times where God's working in our lives, like we were discussing a little bit ago, we knew God was working, but we didn't actually see it because we didn't have the heart to see it. You have to be intentional and that is an intentional way of looking at what God is doing for you, even in the little things that maybe you just didn't think that, maybe that was God, it just seemed too easy to whatever, but maybe that was God working. Remember a prayer that you did five years ago. You said, oh, please, lord, do this. And you never prayed it again because you just forgot, you didn't care, whatever. And then, boom, it happens five years later and you can reflect on that and say you know what this sounds like? A prayer I made five years ago. God is good. That's crazy that he remembered and he stuck with it and he did something with it. So it's a trend. I can see it. It's going to be a trend.
Speaker 1:You got a hashtag gig break, because I feel like, before I even read it, I feel like I had already heard it and I was like I don't know, this just seems so familiar, it just makes sense. And then I saw it. I was like, yes, I love this, this is a very good idea, and I'm going to try to be more intentional. I don't know if I'll be able to write it down, but I am trying to be more intentional on seeing where God is working, because I know he's always working and I've seen in my whole life where he's worked. But I don't want to have a hindsight moment. I want to be in the moment and realize at that moment, this is God working, he is good and I want to be able to exalt him at that moment too. So it was a wonderful thing for me. So thank you.
Speaker 2:Oh, thank you, and I mean exactly like you said. I think it's beautiful to live with your eyes wide open to see how God is weaving your story throughout your life. I mean, I think I see it a little bit in how my husband is in the military and so we move a lot, and the relationships that I build at each duty station and each friendship that I make, and I can see God working in all of those things, and it's truly made me almost not even believe in coincidences. I don't think coincidences are a thing. I think it's always God working and weaving people's stories together in his hand. I mean, it's unfathomable. That was a tongue twister. You know the way that he works. We can't, in our limited minds, understand the way that he works, and I think it's beautiful to just keep an eye out for that all the time because we can see it.
Speaker 1:I agree. Well, I have one more question for you. Now that you have your own family and you have your daughter, what values are you teaching her that are different or similar from your upbringing?
Speaker 2:Yes, so I'm very, very honest with her.
Speaker 1:I'm probably more honest than I should be with an eight-year-old, but you know I'm the same way with my kids, so don't feel too bad. I keep it as a PG for the younger ones as I can, but honesty is very important. Pg for the younger ones as I can, but honesty is very important. Not to cut you off, just to affirm what you're saying.
Speaker 2:No, I love it. And I mean really. I think growing up there was such a secrecy around my parents' lives that I remember feeling like gosh, did they ever do anything bad? Am I just awful? Am I the only one messing up and never really understanding that? And tell her the moments where I felt shame, and I tell her the moments that were hard for me, and I use that and I say learn from mommy's mistakes, learn from what I learned and let that help you.
Speaker 2:And so I take the same approach with Faith. I am very real and honest with her about reading the Bible and really she's taught me she. Actually she came home from school, man, I think she might have been pre-K or kindergarten and she went to a Christian school and she came home and she said Mom, did you know John the Baptist was Jesus's cousin, and I was like I don't know. And then I looked it up and I was like you're correct. That was at the beginning, you know, of when I had just started my faith journey and I was like, wow, lana, you're correct, you know. And so when I tell her things and actually researching and watching the YouTube videos that you sent me, I was listening to one of those episodes and she heard it and she asked what they were talking about, and so I explained it to her, you know, in kids terms, where she could understand it, and she was like, oh yeah, absolutely no, god is the most important. And you know, and she reiterated to me, um back what I had said to her. And it's funny, yesterday we actually had a pretty hard morning, slept through her alarm, we were late getting to school and there was a part in her routine that she had skipped and I asked her if she did it and she said yes, and I was like it's okay if you didn't do it, but I need you to go back and do it before we go to school. And she was like, okay, if she went. You know she did the task. I said I'll be waiting in the car.
Speaker 2:And so we were in the car and I said you know, we really need to talk about lying and that that's not what God wants from us. And we had a real conversation about it. I said I'm going to be done talking about this. I've made my point. I don't have to sit here and go in circles and go over it again. But you know. I just want you to think about what we talked about. And then I asked her. I said you're going to miss worship at school. They do a couple songs of worship before they start school because they feel like it starts their day off. Well, love that. I said you're going to miss worship because we're late. Do you want to listen to a specific worship song? Is there one that you want to listen to in the car? She said no, it was, you know, upset.
Speaker 2:Normally I would turn around and say you know you're mad at me, for you know you lying to me, you're mad at me. And something in me just told me no, just let it go and turn on the music and just keep driving. So I did. Going off the highway to get to her school, and she heard a sniffle in the back seat and I turned around and she was just crying in the back seat and I was like, oh my, what's honey, what's wrong? And she was like I just I got mad at you and I'm the one that lied and I'm so sorry. And she felt conviction and so I turned that around when we got to school and I said, sweetheart, it's okay.
Speaker 2:Mamas are tough. We are, you know our kids aren't always going to be happy with our decisions, but you felt conviction and you made that emotionally intelligent connection that you lied and then you got mad at me. That means that you're walking with God in the right way, because his Holy Spirit was able to give you a conviction. It's things like that that I try to implement into her daily life to teach her that it's about a relationship. She learns the doctrine, she learns the scripture when we go to Sunday school or church or Bible studies. She learns all that. But for me, to really drive home to her that it's a relationship, because I don't want her to grow up like I did, thinking that God is against her. I just don't want that for her, and I think it's going pretty well. She seems to have it. She teaches me all the time, so that's yeah.
Speaker 1:That's wonderful. That's great. Thank you so much for coming on today. This has been a fun conversation. I've learned a lot and you are a wonderful person so bubbly and exciting and your daughter sounds amazing too.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much. I've loved being here. I've loved having the conversation with you. It's awesome.
